Robin John believes investing can help the world rejoice. 

In 2007, he founded Eventide Asset Management, a firm that helps people invest without compromise. In this podcast, Robin shares the tension he felt early in his career while sleeping on a brand new bed in India as the guesthouse cook slept on the cold hard kitchen floor. While American management could have had a redemptive impact on the guesthouse they outsourced to, they chose not to, and that didn’t sit right with Robin. 

At that moment, he felt a conviction that many Christian investors face at some point: that wealth can be more responsibly deployed and stewarded. The institutions we trust with our capital somtimes let us down, so he started Eventide as a way to offer an uncompromising Christian voice in the industry.

Robin joins the show to talk about how to identify ETF and Mutual Funds that align with your values, and what mafia wives have to do with Faith Driven Investing. 

Episode Transcript

Rusty Rueff: Hey, everyone, welcome back to the Faith Driven Entrepreneur podcast. Robin John believes in the power of investing. He founded Eventide Asset Management in 2007 with two Christians who were looking for ways to help people invest without compromise. As CEO of Eventide, Robin has helped the firm grow into a leader within values based investing. He and the team believe that investing rightly can help the whole world rejoice. Robin joins the show today to talk about Eventide’s origin story, how he navigated the early challenges and why Christians should be conscientious investors. Let’s listen in.

Rusty Rueff: Well, William, here we are.

William Norvell: We’re back.

Rusty Rueff: We’re back. We’re back. And you know, it feels like someone’s missing.

William Norvell: I know. I know.

Rusty Rueff: It does, doesn’t it?

William Norvell: Who could it be? Who could it be?

Rusty Rueff: I don’t know. I don’t know, because anybody who listens to the podcast knows that you and I don’t speak first. […]

William Norvell: Well, maybe we could hide it. Maybe I could ask questions about ice cream, and maybe people would think Henry’s here.

Rusty Rueff: That is possible. And I can talk about Dungeness crabs.

William Norvell: Yep. Yep. But, you know, we’re unfortunately down a man today. Mr. Kaestner is not with us. We miss you greatly. Yeah. So, you know, we hope our audience sticks around and enjoys Rusty and I.

Rusty Rueff: Yeah. So it’s the middle of July of 2022 as we date stamp this. Top where I am is hot where you are?

William Norvell: Not really. It’s kind of nice here, but that’s why, you know, we pay crazy taxes in California.

Rusty Rueff: Yeah. Yeah. So Williams on one side of the country, I’m on the other in Rhode Island. And we’re welcoming our guest in today not far from me up in Boston. And get this, William, how would you like to be involved with a firm whose mission statement is investing that makes the world rejoice?

William Norvell: Hmm. That’s pretty good. I know this is not a recruitment podcast, but Robin may be in trouble.

Rusty Rueff: They think so. Let’s welcome him and Robin. John, welcome to the Faith Driven Entrepreneur podcast.

Robin John: Hey, thank you so much, Rusty. And thank you, William.

Rusty Rueff: So, Robin, it’s awesome to have you with us. We’ve been waiting anxiously for you to be on our podcast as we’ve had the opportunity to talk to one of your partners on the FDI podcast. But now we have you, which is awesome. And you know, we’re excited for you to tell us all about Eventide Asset Management that you started in 2007 because you saw this need for a different kind of investing, one that makes people rejoice. And I can’t wait to hear more about that. But you have a very unique story about why you left a big firm and started your own thing. Why don’t you tell us about that story?

Robin John: Yes, it was back in 2005. I was at a company, a large custody bank, and it was my first job out of college. I had gone to Tufts University to study economics, and I was spending a year in a place called Pune, India, which is near Mumbai, Bombay. And I was there to help them outsource a lot of the global securities services back office jobs to India. And while I was there, I was staying at a guest house and I am 25 years old at the time. And I remember staying in the guest house. There was a cook and a housekeeper, the housekeeper, his name was Amal and the cook’s name was Kamal. So Amal and Kamal, these guys were probably about my age as well. And so I got pretty close to them and connected to them. I felt like these were just two of my friends and there were other Americans and British employees staying up at the guesthouse. And often when the guesthouse was empty, I would just spend time with Amal and Kamala to get to know them better, and I would hang out in the kitchen area while they cook. These guys would cook breakfast for me, dinner for me. They would iron my clothes for me, laundry, all of it. And so I just wanted to get to be friend them and get to know them better. So I’m in the kitchen talking to them while they are cooking. And I noticed, you know, behind the kitchen there’s a pantry and there’s like a prayer mat on the floor of the pantry. And I remember saying to them, Hey, do you guys sleep there? And they said, Yes, sir, we do. And I remember thinking, Man, it’s so hot in this kitchen and humid and it’s even hotter in that little pantry where the two of them are curling up to sleep. And there’s no pillow. There’s a hard like concrete floor. And meanwhile, I have a bedroom with an air conditioner. Beautiful, brand new bed. And there are lots of these empty bedrooms in that guesthouse. And I remember thinking to myself that night when I’m lying in bed, remember thinking just about Amal and Kamal lying in that pantry, and I couldn’t fall asleep. And so I remember writing to American management, telling them, Hey, you guys got to give them a place to sleep. And the response I got was, Well, you know, we’re outsourcing the guesthouse. There’s a supplier. They’re responsible for their own employees. And I remember thinking to myself, this huge American company could easily have an impact here and influence over this very small guesthouse company in Pune, India. And they chose not to. And a few days later, I remember sitting in the living room and there was an American employee walking out through the front door of the living room. And Kamal, the cook, was walking into the house. And the American employee said to Kamal, servants should not use the front door. And I remember sitting there, like, feeling terrible. And you know, I moved to the U.S. when I was eight years old on my eighth birthday. When I first came to the U.S., I didn’t speak English. And it was kind of a difficult five, six years for me. I used to get picked on a lot. All the names like Habib and Apu. Where does your dad work? The Kwik-E-Mart or the 7-Eleven? So like, I think in that moment I kind of felt all that pain, that Kamal’s feeling. And so then Kamal walks in, looks at the floor, looks at me and says, Sir, I am a human being too. And I didn’t have words because I was feeling the pain that he was feeling. And the only way I think I could explain that feeling is from the Bible is when Moses is confronted with the Egyptian taskmaster beating up on the Hebrew slave. And though he was the prince of Egypt, there was something inside of him that identified as a Hebrew. And he felt the pain of that beating, and he needed to do something about it. And, you know, the book of Hebrews says that Moses, though he was the son of Pharaoh’s daughter, chose rather to be afflicted with the people of God than to enjoy the pleasures of Egypt. So for me, you know, God has blessed me. This is many years later now, but I still would rather and I still do identify more with the Kamals of the world than what that American colleague of mine. So that was kind of my entry into the business world. And I think I was just disillusioned by business very early coming out of college and with my first job.

Rusty Rueff: Wow. So I would think that that was probably a scary moment for you too? Right. I mean, so take us through how did God speak to you or did you seek him out in prayer to try to make the decision to leave and that that was the right thing to do? And, you know, was it a scary move?

Robin John: Yes. I don’t know that it was a scary move, but it was definitely a difficult move for me leaving that place. I felt that I was having a lot of impact. I really enjoyed my one year being back in India. You know, I was involved with various ministries in the evenings in slums, sharing the gospel. I really valued being there. But I had lost a sense of passion for the work. And I had fallen under this kind of framework in my own mind that business was bad and that if God was to use me, I needed to be in ministry, in church ministry. So I had this framework that, you know, many people would refer to as the sacred secular mindset, where if you’re going to do something for God, you got to be in church ministry. A missionary in a developing country somewhere and everything else is just selfish and about making money.

William Norvell: Yeah, absolutely. And gosh. I don’t think you’re alone there. You know, I know. I’ve felt that before, and I. I mean, I’ll share my own story. I feel like it comes from, you know, if you sit in the pews of a church, a normal church, I think for a long time, that’s kind of who you see on stage, right? That’s who they bring out to talk is the missionaries and the people running nonprofits. And, you know, I can’t ever remember seeing a teacher or a doctor or a business person on stage telling their story of how they’re serving God in their vocations. I think the church has to own some of that. It’s almost by osmosis that that’s what you would imagine is the highest calling.

Robin John: That is right. I’ll give you a small story of that. So even a few years ago, I was in an Indian church and a visiting evangelist pastor was in the church and he was preaching that day. Afterwards, he came to greet me. I’m talking to him. He said, mone, mone mean son. What are you doing for God? And I started talking about the work I do through Eventide. He said, No. I asked you, What are you doing for God? And I had just come back from Tanzania. I have a first cousin who is a full time missionary in Africa. I had been to Tanzania twice that year. I was teaching Sunday school in that church. I was the youth director on the church. If I had mentioned any of that, that would have been a satisfactory response. Most pastors don’t understand work from a biblical perspective.

William Norvell: That’s so good and sad at the same time? And and of course, I feel like some people are waking up here and there, but it’s still not mainstream yet. So if pastors don’t get it. How did you come to understand the biblical message of work and what led you to start Eventide?

Robin John: It was actually through a lot of prayer. So I left this large custody bank and I should have spent a lot of time in prayer at that point. But I took kind of the first job that came along. And ultimately, long story, I end up getting fired from that job within a few months. And that led me to a lot of prayer. And I was living in my parents basement in the Boston area at the time. And one half of the basement was finished and the other half was unfinished. And the washing machine and dryer and the burner, the the water heater was all on that unfinished side of the basement. And so I didn’t want my brother or a first cousin that was living with me to see me late nights, kind of crying and praying. But that’s what I would do. I would go to the unfinished part of the basement, kneel behind the washing machine where nobody could see me and just pray. And I would cry and I would just ask God to show me what I could do with my life. And at that point, I was really praying that God would call me into church ministry, because, again, that’s the framework I had regarding, hey, if I’m going to honor God and do something for God, that is what I should do. And ultimately the cousin I was living in our house said, Robin, what’s going on? I said, What are you talking about? He said, Where’s your laptop? You’ve been coming home without a laptop. So every day I had been leaving the house in the morning, acting like I’m going to work and looking for jobs at the library, and then late nights I’m spending time in prayer. And so I ended up telling my parents and at that point I asked Finny. Finny is the co-founder of Eventide, along with me and my brother. And Jason was also involved very early on. Jason is the third founding member. He was living in Louisville, Kentucky, so he would join us by telephone and we started praying together once a week. We would fast all day and we would pray together. And the initial prayer was, what should Robin do with this life. And meanwhile, even as I’m praying by my washing machine, I would kind of meditate over Romans Chapter 12 together. That’s a chapter I had memorized as a little kid. And we often think about Romans Chapter 12, verse two talks about not conforming to the patterns of the world, but. The verse also says that we have to renew our minds. So not conforming to the patterns of the world and renewing of mind should go together. So I had not yet renewed my mind. So I was still under that framework of thinking about serving God only through church ministry. So as I started praying with Finny and Jason and my brother, we started asking ourselves the question Can we do something together for God? Initially it was, Hey, what should Robin do? And there were some more short type ideas that we had nonprofit ideas, but then some business ideas impact. Business ideas started to come through as we were praying together and having these conversations. One of those ideas was to help Christians and values driven investors align their values and their investments.

William Norvell: Oh, that’s great. And tell us a little more. So where is Eventide today to take us one layer deeper into, you know, what is aligning Christians and their values and investments mean? What did that mean when you started and maybe how what does that come to mean over the last 15 years to you?

Robin John: Yeah. So we have a broader framework at Eventide of avoid, embrace, engage, and really God took us through a journey in understanding that framework. So when we first decided to launch an investment firm, we were more focused on avoid. We saw scriptures like Proverbs Chapter one that talked about avoiding ill gotten gain. It says there are verses like my son if sinful men entice you do not go along with them. If they say come along with us. And then at that time I started reading those scriptures with the lens of an investor. And if they say, come along with us, we will get all sorts of valuable things, we will get all sorts of profits, dividends, capital gains, and fill our houses with plunder and fill our bank accounts. Our 401k plans, our IRAs with plunder, cast lot with us, invest with us. We will share the common purse and mutual fund, an ETF, a private fund. It’s a common purse that many people are sharing in the prophets together. And the passage goes on to say, do not share a purse with such people. Do not go along with ill gotten gain or with plunder. And so. Passages like that really impacted our view so that avoid component of that framework of avoid and embrace and gauge came first for us. And then there was a man named Tim Weinhold that. I really believe that God miraculously brought to us because he came two weeks before the launch of the [….] funds to this house church that Finny and I were leading. And the House Church is mostly college students. There’s about 20 people in the house church. Tim randomly googled house churches in Cambridge, Massachusetts, and he shows up at the house church. Tim had never been to a house church in his life. He still with Eventide. So he would tell you he had never been to a house church in his life. And Tim also was a student of faith and business, probably more than anybody else in the country, at least that I knew. There’s a book called Why Business Matters to God by a person named Jeff Van Duzer, the dean of the Seattle Pacific University. Tim was on his advisory board. And so Tim somehow shows up at our house church in Cambridge overhear about this Christian mutual fund we’re about to start. And then he said, okay, I know what it means to be a Christian. I know what a mutual fund is. Put that together for me. And we don’t use our language Christian Mutual Fund anymore. We say values based mutual fund or values based investing. But we explained to them we would be avoiding ill gotten gain. He said, You know, that’s great, but if you’re investing capital and you’re allocating capital, where should Christians allocate capital? And that’s how we started studying the Bible even more deeply, starting in Genesis one and two of creation and God calling good the things that He creates and creating us in his image. So the work that we do and the things that we create and partner with should be things that God could call good. And then the second great commandment in the Bible to love your neighbor as yourself. The Apostle Paul in Galatians said that all the commandments are summed up in that one commandment to love your neighbor as yourself. So we started to ask ourselves, who are the neighbors to a business? And in Leviticus Chapter 19, when we read to love your neighbor verse, it’s actually speaking to business people. Vineyard owners, farmers, how they should treat their hired servants, how they should treat the employee, the poor and the community. So we asked ourselves, what are all the neighbors to a business? And we came up with six neighbors, stakeholders, customers, employees, supply chain, host communities, environment and society. So ultimately, that’s where the embrace component comes into the Eventide story. We seek to invest and partner with companies that are loving their neighbors, that are serving well, these six stakeholders.

Rusty Rueff: That’s really good. I’m glad you dove into that embrace component because it was a little hard for me. I get avoid and I get engage, but trying to figure out, you know, who should we embrace and how should we embrace. And that’s a great litmus test that you just took us through there. So thank you for that. You know, when you decided to get into investing, you’ve talked about you saw two major problems. And I think you borrowed from Randy Alcorn. And you call these the Mafia wife problem and the Godfather problem. I’m interested, you know, can you unpack those two ideas for us?

Robin John: Yes. Randy Alcorn in his book Money, Possessions and Eternity has a chapter on investing. He talks about the Mafia wife problem. I think I probably created the term The Godfather problem. And in all honesty, I only saw the movie The Godfather for the first time about a month ago.

Rusty Rueff: No. No

Robin John: Yeah, I’ve only seen part one. I’m looking forward to seeing part two. And so the Mafia wife problem, I think, is well captured in the final scene of The Godfather movie. I don’t know if you remember. Al Pacino’s character takes over and he’s a new godfather or the new Don. And there’s a scene at the very end. He kills his own brother in l aw, and his sister is crying and saying, Why would you do this? But his wife, the last scene of the movie, Al Pacino, is with his gangsters in one room of the house. And you can see the wife at a distance standing in the other room. She could see what’s happening in the other room. But she’s close enough, but not too close. Right. And then the movie kind of ends with kind of the door closing and kind of she kind of fades away or he fades away and like he finishes with her face at the very end. So it’s this idea that the mafia wife, she knows something’s happened and she enjoys the fine clothing, the fur coats, the jewelry, the gold, the pearls. And she knows her husband is involved because she’s close enough to the situation, but not too close where she’s asking the meaningful questions. If she got too close, her conscience would be pricked. So the movie kind of shows her close, but not too close. And she’s benefiting from all of this. And so the Godfather problem is really, you know, what I think of in terms of, you know, Don Corleone, you know, the first godfather, Al Pacino’s father. He was especially, I think, even more likable as a character. Al Pacino, towards the end becomes kind of mean in that movie. But his father, like people liked him. They would come to him for help. So it’s this idea that The Godfather, he beats up people. He’s got gangsters he’s involved in, like alcohol business and doing a lot of things that’s really ill gotten gain type businesses. But then other people are coming to him for help and he’s a hero to some. And I think sometimes unknowingly Christians fall into that trap where we are profiting from things like tobacco, where the poorest children in the world are being exploited, but then we feel good about it. One, we don’t even know that we’re profiting from tobacco because these things are being hidden inside of mutual funds and 401 K plan and things. So I’m not blaming anyone. But then we feel good about that profit because we’re not giving away ten, 20, 30, 40, 50% of that to the poor. And, you know, in the Bible, there is a principle. Of not bringing tithe from ill gotten gain into the temple.

Rusty Rueff: Yeah. I mean, I think a lot of us don’t look below the surface when it comes to things like mutual funds or different investment vehicles. Do you have like some practical advice about what we can do? Should should we be peeling it back? And then what do you do with that mutual fund when you see that one company or maybe a couple of companies that make you uneasy?

Robin John: So the biggest problem is there are so many layers in the public markets that hide the actual investment. So somebody might have an account at a large custodian and they may choose it could be a 401k plan, it could be an IRA, it could be a regular investment account. It could be a target date fund, a target risk fund. It could just be an asset allocation fund. But they would just choose their risk profile, moderate, aggressive, conservative. And then they’re done. They check off that box and then they don’t know anything more than that. But then if you peel under the layer and look at what is this asset allocation fund or this target risk fund investing in, it will be a list of mutual funds, ETFs, generally mutual funds and ETFs. Then what you have to do is go to a website like Morningstar.com or Yahoo finance and put in the ticker symbol of the mutual fund or ETF and look at the portfolio holdings. It will often tell you the top 25 holdings. And then there are screening binders. There are many of them that tell you what these companies are involved with. Or you could just look at the company website. So, for example, a company like Philip Morris International is an obvious example. You know, that’s a tobacco company. So there are some of these obvious examples that might pop out at you. And my recommendation would be write to the mutual fund portfolio manager, write to the Investor Relations Department, and tell them what your values are and say, I’m investing with you, but your investments don’t align with my values. Start voicing that feedback and ultimately search out portfolio managers whose values do align with yours.

William Norvell: Now, that’s really good. And, you know, I think I’m going to ask a personal question because and so when I hear that, I just think, you know, so let’s say I don’t have a ton of assets, you know, what’s the first step there? I mean, just be candid, right? There’s a lot of work going through the stages, emailing a portfolio manager. Is that the first step? Is it finding a financial advisor that understands your needs? Can you do this alone? How do you think through that?

Robin John: My recommendation for most people is to find a financial advisor, and the best place to find a financial advisor is Kingdom Advisors. Their annual conferences draw about 2000 Christian financial advisors from across the country. That is a good place to get started. Connect with a financial advisor. Tell them what your values are. They will help you build a portfolio that aligns with your values. They will look at your existing portfolio and help you to better align your values within your existing portfolios as well.

William Norvell: That’s great advice and I’ve been on one of their companies yet and just so people know that organization. They don’t have financial advisors, they get accreditation. And so those advisors are from Merrill Lynch or American Express or Morgan Stanley. They’re from all over, but they have self-identified into understanding the biblical message of investing, and that’s a great place to start. Okay, so flipping back to your entrepreneurial journey, I’m guessing creating a new category of investing was not the easiest thing in the world. Could you tell us a bit about some of the early challenges you and Finny and the other founders had getting started, and what kept you motivated as you were starting to build a business?

Robin John: Yeah, we had a bunch of early challenges and I’ll give you a couple of examples of that. But let me just say throughout all of it, because we started with lots of prayer, we would fast once a week for many months together. We would then pray in the evenings and then break our fast late night. So we would do this. And so because of this, we felt a high level of conviction that we were doing the right thing and that God was leading us. And I mentioned the Tim Weinhold example, so like God started bringing the right people to us and we really felt that we were following God’s will in our life. So our path was clear to us because of that, whether or not we were successful by worldly standards or not, we believed we were being faithful. So. When Finny and I first started, like I remember, the first hurdle was Finny’s concern, Finny, said Robin. Christian Mutual Fund. Are we guilting Christians and investing with us by using the Bible? And that’s the last thing we want to do. And. I am so proud of the team that we have at Eventide today. Our marketing director, Sherry. She has that same conscience and that is such an ongoing conversation at Eventide is how do we make sure that we don’t say, does says the Bible therefore invest with Eventide. So that was an early struggle for us. Another early struggle for us was. What if we underperform? Is that going to bring dishonor to God? If we’re leading with biblical principles and we underperform. Does that somehow bring shame to God’s word? So that was another big concern and hurdle that we had to overcome. You know, as we were praying before, we said, okay, let’s go, we’re going to do this. Ultimately, we decided that if we could lead with excellence. And lead with our mission and values. Then both Christians and non-Christians will find it appealing. And that has been the case. Eventide, both our employee base and our investor base is very diverse. The Kingdom Advisor audiences, those financial advisors tend to invest with us more heavily. But we, I remember one of our first investors, those Moslem investors and Hindu investors were early investors with us because they loved the fact that we were leading with values.

William Norvell: So that’s amazing to me and it’s encouraging. Right. I mean, when I hear that, I get encouraged because I think that’s a beautiful picture of business. Could you for our audience, I’m curious if you would mind sharing. I don’t even know how to ask this question. I want to be clear, but how does that practically play itself out into the business? So you have a diverse workforce. We’ve had Finny on the podcast as well. I’m certain lots of your employees listen to these podcast and know that you are open about how your faith is it. Does it come out and how you treat people and how you love them well. Like, how are they on board with the vision? Does that make sense? Sorry, it’s a bad question, but.

Robin John: No, I think it’s a very good question. I would love to have one of my non-Christian employees on the call. They would tell you that Eventide has high integrity to our mission, and Eventide is a place that is highly, highly inclusive for Christians and non-Christians. Our purpose statement is Eventide strives to honor God and serve its clients by investing in companies that create compelling value for the global common good. And when it comes to even on negative screens, we do have screens that are very faith oriented. For example, an abortion screen. But all of our people, as they go through the interview process with Eventide, I make it very clear to them that working at Eventide is not about faith alignment. It’s about mission and values alignment. And I would say, sadly, Christians push back on our mission as much or more than non-Christians do at times. So we really lead with mission and values and not with faith. Even though our mission and values come from our faith, our why for Finny and me and Jason is our faith, our our belief in Christ and the great commandment to love your neighbor as yourself.

William Norvell: Can I ask you to go one layer deeper? What specifically to Christians push back on often? I’m curious.

Robin John: Yeah, there’s a bunch of different areas. And so broadly the biggest area I would think is a lot of Christians are still under a mindset of make all you can to give all you can. And there’s this there’s an assumption that aligning values leads to underperformance. And I often say to people, I believe that biblical principles are good for us in this life and in the next life, right? So into eternity, but also in this life of the Bible is full of wisdom and following. The biblical commandments are good for us. And so that is one big push back is does make all you can to give all you can. John Wesley, the founder of the Methodist Church, preached a sermon called The Use of Money. In that sermon, he said, Make all you can to give all you can, but make all you can without hurting yourself or your neighbor in body or in soul. So I think that’s a good principle for all Christians. And I would also say that for people that really buy into make all you can to give all you can. I would also say that, first of all, if you look at the dominant 400 index or there’s a group called the PRI Institute, they have an index that they’ve tracked. And what they do is they do negative screening. And just from a negative screening standpoint, there isn’t any evidence of outperformance or underperformance over a long period of time. But at Eventide, we believe that the positive screening and partnering with companies that are creating compelling value for the global common good, in fact, does lead to better performance over the long term.

Rusty Rueff: That’s great. That’s absolutely great. So we’re going to transition now to our Lightning Round, which is where we ask William. And I will ask you, you know, really quick questions. You can repeat them back if you if you’d like, and we’d like you to answer in less than 30 seconds. Most of them won’t take that that long, but it’s a way to just to get to know you. So if you’re okay with that. You going with that? All right. Good. Yeah. All right, here we go. Veg or non-veg?

Robin John: Non-Veg. But Finny is a Veg. Finny’s a vegan.

Rusty Rueff: Finny is a vegan.

Robin John: Yeah, but I eat pretty much everything if you put something in front of me, I’ll. I’ll eat it.

Rusty Rueff: All right? Okay. All right. I wish Finny was here because I would ask him the difference between there’s, like, impossible or beyond meat, and I’m a vegetarian, so I always find that an interesting question. Okay. Best Indian food in Boston.

Robin John: Best Indian food in Boston, I would say probably Punjab, which is a restaurant in Arlington, Massachusetts. But all the Indian restaurants in Boston are north Indian food. Lots of cream. I prefer South Indian food. Unfortunately, I can’t find any South Indian Kerala restaurants. Kerala is the state I’m from in Massachusetts.

Rusty Rueff: Okay, great. Make note of that and this.

William Norvell: Business opportunity if anyone’s listening. Business opportunity.

Rusty Rueff: There you go. There you go. Okay. Is there a sector that you regret not investing in because you’ve seen it just blow up in a positive way?

Robin John: That would be a better question for Finny. We have been pretty diversified in our mutual funds. I’m sure there are plenty of companies that we haven’t invested in that have blown up in a good way. But in terms of sectors, I’m not sure that I could give you an answer to that.

Rusty Rueff: Is there a company you just say, we just missed it?

Robin John: There are many companies that I would say that about, and there are companies in the biotech space even that I know that we were tracking. And I got to be careful in naming companies. But I’ll give you an example. Very early on, Chipotle was a company that I really liked a lot personally. This was back in 2008. But Finny had concerns about two things. One, we don’t invest in meat at all at Eventide. And so that was one of the concerns with Chipotle. And second was they do serve alcohol and we have an alcohol screen. Right. But that company has done really well since that point.

William Norvell: Wow. Okay. That’s really interesting. What is and we talked about one of them with Kingdom Advisors, but maybe there’s another one. I’m going to ask it again. What’s one thing that Christians can do to become more conscientious investors? So if someone’s sitting here today and wants to do one thing, what would you do?

Robin John: Do one thing. Look at your portfolio. The biggest problem Christians have is they don’t know what they’re investing in. So go to Morningstar.com or Yahoo! Finance, put in the ticker symbols and just click on portfolio. You could see the holdings that will be eye opening to you.

William Norvell: Okay. Last one for me. I’ve heard that you and the team at eventide, keep an extraordinarily low traveling budget. So we’re interested. Advice for entrepreneurs who also don’t have a budget because they just don’t have that much money. How do you make a business trip fun on a low budget?

Robin John: You must have heard that about me in the early years. I don’t do that to our people anymore.

William Norvell: Okay.

Robin John: So the first couple of years, we were struggling just to get any assets under management. And so Jason and I would travel and we kept a budget for ourselves of $50, including taxes. And we made an agreement among ourselves that if the room for the hotel or the motel is from the inside, it’s good enough for us. And there were a couple of times my wife could not believe it when she would travel with me. But that’s years like one, two, three, four. Nowadays, I don’t even look at the expenses. Our team, I want them to be comfortable and well taken care of. And so, yeah, I think those stories are from the very early years of eventide.

William Norvell: Wow, that’s amazing. Well, thank you for doing that, Robin. And now we’re going to move to our close. And what we love to do is ask you about something we all hold dear, which is God’s word. And we would love to invite you to share something from God’s word that impacted you. It could be something you read this morning, could be something you’ve been meditating on for a season, or could be something he planted in your heart a long time ago. But we’d love to invite you to share from God’s word with our audience.

Robin John: Yeah. I mean, there’s so many scriptures that has impacted me over the years. For me. I love the Psalms, especially the Psalms by David, because David is a person that is a person that in many ways is just a fallen person. Right. Just, you know, had sins in his life. Yet through the Psalm, you could just see the the love that he has for God. And so like as a deer panteth for the water. So my soul, longeth after you psalms like that I just, it just moves me. Psalm 63. I don’t think David wrote Psalm 63, but he talks about how the Psalmist, this longing for God as in a dry and weary land. And He says that he wants to experience God as with bone and marrow. And I think for most Americans, that doesn’t even make much sense. Bone and marrow. So the NIV translation says, ask what the finest of foods and but me being from India, if you’re eating like a beef curry or a goat curry with bone in it, you suck on the marrow. The marrow actually makes the curry taste much better. Even a chicken curry with a bone in tastes much, much better than just a chicken curry without the bone in. And the taste out of the bone is just so rich from the bone marrow. So I think often for me, I long to experience God the way that David experienced God and David, even though he had everything from a human perspective, he was longing for God as though he was thirsty in a desert and longing to taste God as with like bone and marrow. And so that kind of a desire to love God and to follow God’s commandments, even like Psalm 119, it just talks about just the commandments of God are just so good. How can a young man keep his way pure? Oh, how I love your law. Reading the Psalms just makes me realize just how much more in love with God these men and women were back in those times. And they are longing for God. And I, you know, my prayer is that I would long for God in such a way.

Rusty Rueff: Robin. That’s a fantastic close. We so thank you for being on the episode and thanks for investing. That makes the world rejoice. We need more rejoicing, that’s for sure. So thank you so much. And we wish you the best. And God bless. And we’ll have you back on again sometime soon.

Robin John: Hey, thank you so much, Rusty. And thank you, William.

— by Amanda Lawson

Do not despise small beginnings.

Zechariah 4 presents a prophetic encounter that theologians could write volumes on, but the gist is that God’s people were returning from exile and their new city would be beautiful and God would be there with His people and there would be amazing redemption and restoration. The man responsible for rebuilding the physical city in real time was Zerubbabel. “Not by might nor by power” but by the Holy Spirit, Zerubbabel would lead this restoration project of literal biblical proportions. Zechariah goes on to explain that the Lord told him not to despise “these small beginnings” because the Lord Himself rejoices to see the work begin. 

But I like big beginnings, explosive and powerful burning bush level moments and ocean waves that 6-foot surfers can stand up under. I’m not an overly patient person when I have a clear goal in mind. 

Yet, in my current position, the Lord has taught me a lot about not despising small beginnings. 

In April, the L.I.F.E. (Leading the Integration of Faith and Entrepreneurship) Research Lab at Miami University (OH) hosted the 2nd Annual L.I.F.E. Research Conference. Academics from around the world came together virtually to celebrate and explore research opportunities at the intersection of faith and work. It was a day full of deep discussion, provocative questions, and community building.

A keynote address by Baylor University professor, Peter Klein, kicked off the conference. Garry Bruton (Texas Christian University) and Jeff McMullen (Indiana University) presented a point-counterpoint discussion on the opportunities and challenges to including religion in entrepreneurship research. Panel discussions surrounding identity, economics and theology, international markets, social entrepreneurship, and more provided space for conversations with leading academics from Dartmouth College, University of Tennessee, Butler University, Oklahoma University, University of Missouri-Kansas City, and Virginia Tech. 

Prior to the conference, we distributed a call for research proposals by doctoral students who are working in this space and offered a chance to submit a plan and pitch to the audience in hopes of securing funding to finish their work. Three finalists were chosen to pitch live and attendees were given the chance to vote for the winner. Zanele Lurafu (Jönköping Business School) won the competition, earning $5,000 in research funding. Runners up, each receiving $2,500, were Andrea Sottini (Universita Católica del Sacre Coure) and Trevor Israelsen (University of Victoria). 

Later, an overview of the field of faith and entrepreneurship from an editorial team for the journal, Small Business Economics revealed a broad spectrum of topics in entrepreneurship that are deeply influenced by religion. The conference ended with an incredible discussion between Ali Aslan Gümüsay (University of Hamburg), Roy Suddaby (University of Victoria), and Scott Newbert (Baruch College, CUNY) on different theoretical approaches to studying and explaining the role of religion in entrepreneurship. 

When the conference ended, a co-worker asked how it went and all I could say in the moment was “Nothing went wrong. It could have gone better, but nothing went wrong.” I am a skeptic by nature, and while there was nothing inherently untrue in my response, it probably wasn’t the right response.

The reality was—and to an extent, still is—I don’t know how to measure success in this circumstance.  As soon as the conference ended—frankly, even in the days leading to it and during the various events—I sat and pondered what success in this conference would look like. Was it the number of attendees? The number of countries represented? Attendee feedback following the event? Was it about getting recognition in the business school at Miami for the work we put in? What about getting asked to co-author or co-chair future research endeavors? 

Now that some time has passed, I can confidently say that I still don’t really know if the L.I.F.E. Research Conference would be considered a success. Because everyone has different definitions, ranging from Zoom retention rates to post-conference surveys to ongoing conversations with new connections. The truth is, we live and work in a world that is dominated by numbers. And our attendance numbers for this year’s conference weren’t as good as last year’s. But our survey results were better. 

What I can also confidently say is that regardless of the success of the conference itself, our team succeeded. 

I’ve shared in the past (Fear and Trembling and Defining Success, Faith Driven Entrepreneur) that my overall definition of success has changed a lot in the past couple of years, that now it’s not a measure of data, but one of obedience to what the Lord has called me to. And I believe He called us to build and host this conference. 

Because while I believe obedience trumps results, the results point to the Lord. When people ask how we were able to do it, we get to give God the glory. When brilliant academics have a platform to an international audience and get to share their passion for studying faith and work, and even how their personal convictions steer them in the work, God is glorified. When we share about the conference at our department staff meeting and in department newsletters and media, literally thousands of people are able to hear or read about a growing network of college professors and researchers who are bringing faith back into the conversation around entrepreneurship—even at public universities. 

Even if our numbers are small. Even if some days “nothing went wrong” is all we feel like we can offer. Even when it seems like a small, two-person team is trying to push a boulder up an ever-rising mountain. We do not despise small beginnings. We’ve seen too much to doubt the Lord now. So instead, we press on, straining for the prize not out of a need to achieve a data point, but out of a deep gratitude for the opportunity and desire to glorify the Lord in all things. 

*A huge thank you to Brett Smith, Founding Director of the L.I.F.E. Program at Miami University for directing the conference and Bethany Allen for our technical support! 

*Video recordings of the conference are available on  our YouTube channel: L.I.F.E. Miami University

Related articles

If you joined us for the Faith Driven Entrepreneur conference, you’re in for a treat. This is the full interview with Strive Masiyiwa , Founder and Executive Chairman of the Econet, and one of Africa’s most respected business leaders. In this episode, Strive speaks about Africa’s role within the global marketplace. He also shares how faith has empowered him to operate in the world without fear and how other entrepreneurs can go bravely into the spheres God called them. 

If you weren’t there for the live event, you can still access the conference recordings here.

Check out more from Faith Driven Entrepreneur Africa at africa.faithdrivenentrepreneur.org.

Episode Transcript

— by Paul Michalski

“Just about anybody can make an organization look good for a moment, but the best leaders lead today with tomorrow in mind.” (John Maxwell)

The idea that a business leader should see herself as a “steward” of a business is not a new idea, and its not even a uniquely Christian idea.  The U.S. Chamber of Commerce Foundation gives a “Best Corporate Steward” award.  They describe it in terms of “a company that conducts its business in a way that creates ‘shared value’.”

But the “stewardship” demanded of faith-driven business leaders is profoundly different than the “stewardship” urged by the world.  The world essentially sees stewardship as being a “good owner”.  God commands being a “steward” instead of an “owner”.

Although the operational stewardship that would earn a U.S. Chamber of Commerce award and the operational stewardship that would honor God’s command might look very similar in practice, there is a test of stewardship that is uniquely faith-driven.  It is the exercise of stewardship (or a default to ownership) when a leader decides to step down or step out.  

The world says “be a good steward while you own it, get the most money you can at exit, and let the next leader worry about winning the stewardship award” because the world’s version of stewardship is about being a good ”owner” while you own it. I believe the Bible requires stewardship not only in the operation of a business but also in the “hand-off” of the business, because the faith-driven leader never owned it.

The Biblical Basis for “Stewardship”

The Bible is full of passages reminding us that God owns everything.  For example, Psalm 50:12 (“For the world and its fullness are mine“) and Deuteronomy 10:14 (“Behold, to the Lord your God belong heaven and the heaven of heavens, the earth with all that is in it“),  Perhaps the most direct when it comes to wealth is Haggai 2:8:  “The silver is mine, and the gold is mine, declares the Lord of hosts.”

But God didn’t just plop all of creation here without direction or purpose for His greatest creation–humans.  In Genesis 1:28, God gave what I will call the Creation Mandate (what some also refer to as the Cultural Mandate):

And God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and subdue it, and have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over every living thing that moves on the earth.

We are not just another species of animal created to co-exist alongside all others.  We are different and were given a commandment about our purpose on earth.  We are to “have dominion“.

Although that term sounds ominous and, on its face, seems to hold the potential to justify abusing the earth and its creation, theologians (which I do not claim to be) seem to be pretty confident that the term means “stewardship”.  We are to care for God’s creation as its stewards.

In case you were wondering how God owning “creation” relates to the business YOU started, organizations are CREATIONS that become part of God’s creation.   The Creation Mandate extends beyond merely putting together raw physical materials.  It includes “subduing” through the creation of culture and social structures such as organizations.

The Final Test of Stewardship: Succession or Secession

There are really only two basic choices when a leader who has shaped the purpose, values and culture of an organization no longer wants, or is no longer able, to continue to lead the organization—succession or secession.  But I am not talking about who fills the leader’s seat—I am talking about what happens to the HEART of the organization—its real WHY.

One only needs to watch a few episodes of the television series Succession or Yellowstone to see the difficulties and drama that can arise when a strong leader who has shaped a business realizes it needs to pass to the next generation.  The difficulties and drama are as old as King Solomon:

I hated all my toil in which I toil under the sun, seeing that I must leave it to the man who will come after me, and who knows whether he will be wise or a fool? Yet he will be master of all for which I toiled and used my wisdom under the sun. (Ecclesiastes 2:18-19)

Merriam-Webster has these definitions most relevant for our discussion:

• Succession:  the continuance of corporate personality.

• Secession: formal withdrawal from an organization.

In talking about the options for the heart of the organization, this is what I mean by succession and secession.

• Succession of heart: The leader passes leadership to a person or group of persons who share the leader’s commitment to the heart of the organization and are likely to be intentional about continuing to cultivate, curate and protect that heart.  The heart continues.

• Secession of heart: The leader passes leadership to a person or group of persons who do not share the leader’s commitment to the heart of the organization and are unlikely to prioritize preserving that heart and may even take steps to change the heart of the organization.  The heart is withdrawn.

In speaking about legacy, John Maxwell writes:

Just about anybody can make an organization look good for a moment, but the best leaders lead today with tomorrow in mind. . . . Because a leader’s lasting value is measured by succession.

And the Bible suggests another potential legacy path:

Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains alone; but if it dies, it bears much fruit. (John 12:24)

The Succession Option

Succession of heart is even more difficult than succession of a leader. 

Succession of heart can be accomplished in a number of ways, but it requires intentionality.  Here are some examples:

• A Succession Person: The simplest example of heart succession is finding a new leader who shares a commitment to the heart of the organization.  This might be a person groomed in the organization to take over under the same ownership or someone in the next generation who shares that commitment in a family business.  It is much more difficult if the leadership transition is accompanied by an ownership change.

• A Succession Buyer: In a sale to a third-party, succession of heart would mean finding a buyer with that commitment. There are private equity firms whose stated business model is preserving the culture of the organizations they acquire (although it is unclear whether they would honor a faith-driven heart that is aligned with Biblical beliefs, principles and priorities) and even a few (e.g., Sovereign’s Capital) committed to Biblically faithful leadership. If a leader/owner wishes to sell and is unable to find a third-party buyer committed to preserving the organization’s heart, it might be possible to arrange a full or even partial sale to the existing management group or employees (e.g., using an ESOP, which has a number of very interesting “stewardship” benefits) who have helped cultivate and maintain, and who value, the organization’s heart.

• A Succession Contract: Contractually maintaining an organization’s heart following a sale is quite unusual but not unprecedented. The ongoing tension between Unilever and its Ben & Jerry’s subsidiary has been in the news recently.  When the founders of Ben & Jerry’s sold the business to Unilever, they insisted upon quite elaborate contractual provisions designed to preserve the unique culture of Ben & Jerry’s even while under the ownership of Unilever, including maintaining a subsidiary board outside Unilever’s control.

Of course, succession of heart works only for so long as those taking over continue to prioritize maintenance of the organization’s heart, not only while they are leading the organization but also upon the next change in leadership. Even private equity firms that are committed to preserving culture generally only hold that commitment during the 3-5-year period after which their commitment shifts to exiting the investment at the best price for their investors.

The Secession Option

Secession of heart is just as easy as succession of heart is difficult.  

Because the current of the world flows toward “ownership” and the world’s priorities (i.e., business as usual) rather than faith-driven stewardship, leadership transition without a commitment to preserve the organization’s heart will likely (or almost certainly) lead to secession of that heart—particularly a heart of faithful leadership in alignment with Biblical beliefs, principles and priorities.

Here are a few ways it can occur:

• A Secession Leader. Leadership transition to a person who lacks a commitment to the organization’s heart will lead to the erosion (or purposeful elimination) of that heart. One example is ServiceMaster, which was famously known for including “honoring God” in its mission statement and having a statue in front of its headquarters of Jesus washing feet. Bill Pollard was a successor leader committed to succession of the heart of the organization cultivated by its founder.  As Darrell Cosden writes in a paper titled Honoring God and Developing People: ServiceMaster, Bill Pollard and the Heart of the Corporation:

After Pollard’s exit from ServiceMaster God functionally became a much vaguer concept, and ultimately irrelevant to the business goals. . . . When utility reigns supreme, it is not a huge leap to conclude that profit really is the ultimate end goal, and people as well as God/faith can be a part of the means to that end pragmatically, even if optionally. This however is a complete undoing of the entire history, ethos and institutional identity of ServiceMaster.

The Bible is rife with examples of faithful kings and prophets being followed by unfaithful successors.  For example, one only needs to read the story of Hezekiah and his son Manasseh in the Book of Kings to see how quickly a faithful legacy can be unwound.

And [Manasseh] did what was evil in the sight of the Lord . . . .  For he rebuilt the high places that Hezekiah his father had destroyed, and he erected altars for Baal and made an Asherah, as Ahab king of Israel had done . . . .” (2 Kings 21:2-3)

• A Secession Buyer.  There are numerous examples of a faith-inspired heart of an organization disappearing following a sale to a business as usual buyer. You can read about companies with overtly faith-inspired mission statements and values only to go to their websites to find no trace of that heart. A little digging on the Wayback Machine website archive reveals when the website changed.  A little more digging online reveals a sale of the company shortly before the change.

• A Secession Financing.  Taking a business public is a financing step (either financing for the company in a primary offering or an exit financing for owners in a secondary offering) toward secession of heart because ownership and control of a public company is always open to the highest bidder unless intentional steps are taken to preserve control in the hands of successor of heart owners.  For example, Coca-Cola Bottling Co. Consolidated, the largest independent Coke bottler in the United States, is listed on NASDAQ but the founding Harrison family retained voting control through a separate class of common stock.  Coca-Cola Bottling Co. Consolidated is a unique example of a public company that has been able to retain its overtly faithful heart because of the intentionality of its owners.

Succession or Secession: Which Is Better Stewardship?

You might be thinking, “Succession of heart is obviously better faith-driven stewardship than secession of heart“.  Well, not necessarily.

It is easy to idolize succession of heart–pridefully wanting to preserve a faithful legacy–when God might have a different plan.  Yes, as a general matter succession of heart is more often a better path of faith-driven stewardship than secession of heart, but succession can be poor stewardship!

I talk about the heart of an organization, but an organization doesn’t really have a heart.  An organization (including a business) is a platform that facilitates humans working together in relationship.   Those people have hearts about work, and the expression of those hearts forms the culture of the organization.

As part of creation, an organization belongs to God (just like everything else) and God’s plan may be for that particular platform to exist for only a season.  The job of a faithful-driven leader is to steward the organization in a manner consistent with the Creation Mandate, maximizing the flourishing of God’s creation.  In a broken world, the best stewardship of a particular organization at a moment in time might be secession of heart–it might be to allow the “grain of wheat” to die so that God can use it to bear “much fruit”.  For example:

• If the hearts of the humans who have been working in the organization have been transformed to desire and pursue business in alignment with Biblical beliefs, principles and priorities rather than business as usual, God’s desire may be to lead those people out of the organization and sprinkle their hearts to transform the cultures of many other organizations.

• If secession of heart yields the greatest economic value for an organization (e.g., selling at the highest price to a Secession Buyer), God’s desire may be for the faith-driven owners to extract that worldly value and steward it in ways that have an even greater positive impact on the flourishing of God’s creation.  Recall God’s command to the Israelites when they were leaving Egypt:

When he lets you go, he will drive you away completely. Speak now in the hearing of the people, that they ask, every man of his neighbor and every woman of her neighbor, for silver and gold jewelry. (Exodus 11:1-2)

Of course, choosing succession of heart or secession of heart requires prayerful discernment (ideally with trusted friends and counsel)–it must be intentional.   Just as it is easy to idolize succession of heart (and pridefully pursuing legacy), it is even easier to rationalize secession of heart (and selling to the highest bidder).

For example, transferring the business to an ESOP might be more complicated and might be less lucrative at closing than selling to a private equity firm, but it might be better faith-driven stewardship of what God owns.

It is not about what looks good to people who share our faith or what makes us feel good–it is about seeking God’s will.   In his book Why Business Matters to God, Jeff Van Duzer reminds us:

The same God who calls us to [fulfill the creation and redemption mandates in business] provides us with access to the discernment and power that will enable us to fulfill them.

Related articles

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Copyright © 2022 Integrous LLC.  Integriosity is a registered Service Mark of Integrous LLC.

About the Author

Paul Michalski has been on a journey that resulted in the creation of Integrous LLC, a law firm providing integrity advice and legal counsel to faith-driven clients. Integrous is the by-product of a 50-year journey, including 35+ years as a lawyer and 15 years of involvement in marketplace ministry and the faith-work movement. It also reflects Paul’s life-long commitment to “integrity” as a core value and his personal purpose statement: “To serve by redeeming work through the impartation of wisdom, spotlighting God’s truth and connecting its meaning to organizational cultures and practices.” 

Paul graduated from Harvard College, magna cum laude, in 1983 and Harvard Law School, magna cum laude, in 1986.  He became a partner with Cravath, Swaine & Moore and for over 22 years practiced corporate law in New York and London.

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— by Christian Santiago

What is the purpose of the 8 Biblical Pillars of Rapid Transformation?

After studying the Bible to notice what caused people to be changed immediately from one type of person to another in a moment rather than through a gradual change, I wanted to implement them because:

• It could help people change in days rather than decades

• It would give people a roadmap to see what area they’re lacking in & the solution to it

• Christians could see every area of their lives elevated without sacrificing their faith

• I genuinely believe the Bible has all of the success principles for every issue of life

What are the 8 Biblical Pillars of Rapid Transformation?

1. Identity – The most powerful view in your life is not God’s, it’s yours. The power of naming. It’s God changing Jacob’s name to Israel, Jesus changing Simon’s name to Peter. It’s the power of using “I Am” statements.

2. Mindset & Beliefs – The only reason you don’t have everything God says you can have is the story you tell yourself as to why you can’t have it. It’s about shifting your beliefs using the 4 Molders of beliefs.

3. Personal Standards – The difference in the quality of life between two people are the standards they hold themselves and others to. It’s Paul speaking in tongues more than everyone else even though no one told him to. The one thing that bridges the gap between where you are and where you want to be are the standards you have for your life.

4. Habits & Routines – Your habits will define you more than your desires ever will. It causes the standards you set in your life to be a reality, not a fantasy. It’s Jesus waking up early to pray every morning.

5. Community – The relationships you have directly correlate with how great you become. The number one is too small of a number to achieve anything great. No one in the Bible ever achieved anything of great magnitude on their own. 

6. Immersion – If you want to step into mastery at any level at a rapid pace, you must immerse yourself in it. You cannot be something who skims the surface of a subject, you must become someone who goes deep. God rewards those who choose to be diligent at everything they do and become excellent.

7. Permission – Any level you’re not stepping into isn’t because you lack the mental, emotional, or physical capacity. It’s because you lack the emotional permission to do so. The Great Commission can also be called The Great Permission.

8. Ownership – You cannot grow what you do not take ownership or responsibility over the results. If permission makes the next level possible, ownership makes the next level real. It’s taking dominion (i.e. dominating/ruling) over the area God has assigned to you.

#1 – Identity

Identity is the most powerful force in the human personality. God wired us to stay consistent with how we view ourselves. That’s why the most influential view in our lives is not our family, partners, friends, or God’s, is ours. The most correct view in our life, however, is God’s. That’s why the Bible is laden with identity language all throughout with consistent statements of “you are”. This is precisely why “I Am” affirmations/incantations are the most powerful ones any person can utter – it goes down to the core of the person and directs all their thoughts, beliefs, and values to come in alignment with that one identity.

This is another reason why names matter so much because whatever you name something, that’s exactly what it becomes to you. So, if you call your enterprise a small business or a growing empire, that’s exactly what it’ll become. Be careful what identity you assign to yourself and everything around you because it’ll shift rapidly to match that.

Key Verses: Jesus saying, “You are the light of the world. You are the salt of the earth.” Adam naming the animals in Genesis and whatever he named them, that’s what they became.

#2 – Mindset & Beliefs

What’s built on the foundation of the identity of a person are their mindsets & beliefs – what they regard to be true about their model of the world. If someone’s mindset & beliefs are that God doesn’t want them to have wealth, then every setback will not be seen as an opportunity to greater growth. On the other hand, if someone believes that God is for them and wants to bless them all the time, then even failures are not seen as failures but as building blocks. 

That’s why the only difference between a stepping stone and a stumbling block is the person who’s looking at it. And the ability to grow your business in the way God wants you to in this world is directly dependent on the quality of the beliefs you hold in your heart. How to influence them are through the 4 Molders of Beliefs: 

1. Focus – Do you focus on lack or abundance? Failure or the lesson? 

2. Meaning – What does this event mean to you? What meaning have you assigned to it? 

3. Language – What are you saying about your life? Are you speaking life or death about it? 

4. Mental Images/Sounds – What pictures or words do you see or hear in your mind? How do they affect your faith?

Key Verses: Isaiah 26:3; John 9:1-5; Proverbs 18:21; Numbers 13:30-33

#3 – Personal Standards

What’s the difference between two people? 

What’s the one tool we can use to bridge the gap from where we are now and where we know God says we can be in every area of our lives?

The difference in the quality of life between two people are the standards they hold themselves and others to. If you truly want to be someone great and do bigger things than you can even imagine, you have to set standards that scare you. Why?

The only thing that bridges the gap between where you are and where you’re supposed to be are the standards you set for your life. 

But here’s the thing: God sets the vision. You set the standards.

If you don’t accomplish what God placed inside of you or be as influential as He made you to be, it’s not His fault, it’s yours. The higher standards you choose to set will expand your current identity to step into the more powerful identity He has for you. You’ll be more, do more, and have more.

Key Verses: 1 Corinthians 14:18 – Paul saying he spoke in tongues more than everyone even though no one asked him to; Proverbs 12:24 – The diligent shall rule, which means they have higher standards than other people

#4 – Habits & Routines

The key to a faith-driven entrepreneur’s long-term effectiveness are the habits and routines they have in place. 

Why are they so important? Because your habits and routines are the things that establish your standards into place. They help make your new standards your new normal.

Why? Because you’re no longer relying on willpower to live out your standards. They have become automatic.

That’s why your habits will define you more than your desires ever will. Don’t tell me your dreams. First tell me your habits and routines, and it is only then will I know whether you have a vision or a fantasy. They are the thing that changes you from being a shooting star to a shining star – one that’s great over the long-term.

The two routines that matter the most are your morning and evening routines. Your morning routine sets you up to win your day, and your evening routine sets you up to win your morning. 

Key Verses: Luke 22:39 – Jesus made it His custom/habit to visit the Garden of Gethsemane – the place He had His biggest internal victory before He saved the world; Daniel 6:10 – Daniel made it a habit to pray 3 times a day at the same time each day

#5 – Community

What’s one of the most powerful factors that regulates our behaviors?

How is our personal effectiveness tied to the greatness of those around us?

The pillar of community provides rapid transformation and is so powerful because we will always seek to be consistent with the expectations of the people closest to us. If you want your life to elevate quickly, you must elevate your inner circle relentlessly.

There are 3 levels of community:

• Mentor/Coach – Someone who is leading us that we take our cues from

• Peer – Someone who is running with us to encourage, challenge, and empower us

• Mentees – Someone who is below us that we are meant to pull them up

Anytime people have tension within their community and inner circle, it is because they have people in the wrong level. They must be able to put people in the right level and elevate the quality of the people within those circles to experience the rapid transformation they deserve. 

You must get around a community that challenges and inspires you to live at a higher level or else you will settle for one that makes you feel good at the level you choose to settle on.

Key Verses: Proverbs 13:20; 1 Corinthians 15:33

#6 – Immersion 

How do you get to a level of mastery at a faster pace than others?

How can you step into high performance and become world-class in weeks rather than decades?

The answer to these questions lies in the pillar of immersion. When you activate the pillar of immersion, you activate the power to compress decades into days.

There are 3 levels of immersion:

1. Dabbler – Someone who just skims the surface of a subject

2. Achiever – Someone who is content with knowing a lot about something, but isn’t experiencing the full weight of its benefits

3. Master – Someone who is dedicated to mastery where they seek to have automatic fruit

How to step into the place of mastery and use immersion to learn any skill rapidly:

1. Immerse Yourself In It – Better to spend 10 hours in one weekend than 1 hour a week for 10 weeks on just one topic

2. Spaced Repetition – After immersion, spend at least 1-3 hours a month on keeping your skill sharp

3. Use It & Adjust – Continue to make distinctions as you’re using the skill until people start asking you to teach them how to do it – that’s when you’re in a place of heightened proficiency

Key Verses: Moses being with God for 40 days and 40 nights, then coming down with a shining face; Jesus defeating every temptation from Satan for 40 days straight in the wilderness, then living a life of victory afterwards

#7 – Permission

This pillar usually brings the fastest and greatest emotional release in people. 

Why? Because most people have the mental, physical, and spiritual capacity to get to their next level, but many do not possess the emotional permission to do so.

They are waiting for someone else to give it to them or have been held back because they haven’t seen an example of it in their own life, so they don’t go for more than what they currently have. 

In order for a rapid transformation to occur, they must be able to give themselves the permission they’ve been missing instead of looking for an outside influence to give them. It must come from within.

3 Ways We Get Permission:

• Example – See someone else do it and it gives us permission to do the same. “If they can do it, I can, too.”

• Conversion – An event happens that changes them, can be a painful event or a pleasurable one. Ex: Near death experience gives you permission to stop playing small, or birth of a baby gives you permission to truly operate like a father.

• Ritual – A ceremony that gives permission to act different in that context. Ex. Wedding gives permission for a man and a woman to operate like a husband and wife. A Bar Mitzvah gives permission for a Jewish boy to now think and act like a man.

3 Areas We Need To Give Ourselves Permission In:

• Success – Allow yourself to get obsessed with being great. Give yourself permission to build your business to the level you know God has placed inside of you and to have the highest levels of success without sacrificing your faith.

• Struggle – Allow yourself to be bad at something until you finally get good at it. Allow yourself to be criticized by those who don’t understand you and keep going while loving them along the way.

• Significance – Allow yourself to be the first one in your family to succeed at the highest level so you can change your family tree. Allow yourself to be the one who makes a way for others to follow in, even if you’re doing it alone right now.

The reason why you haven’t experienced the success you deserve is because you haven’t given yourself the permission you need.

Key Verses: Matthew 28:18-20 – The Great Commission could also be called The Great Permission

#8 – Ownership

When a person begins to shift from blame to responsibility, that’s when the pillar of ownership activates. 

They will take ownership for them stepping into their next level and begin to assume the identity of who that person is right now rather than waiting for it to happen to become that kind of person.

They will shift from an external locus of control to an internal locus of control. An external locus of control blames the outside circumstances for the lack of a desired result. An internal locus of control assumes complete responsibility for the lack of a desired result.

• External locus of control: “I was late because the traffic was bad.”

• Internal locus of control: “I was late because I didn’t check the traffic to leave early enough. That’s on me.”

This is key because God originally created human beings to rule their world and malfunction in life when their world is ruling them. When our personal world is upside down in some way, we develop high blood pressure, anxiety, etc. When we’re able to make the necessary changes to get our world back in control, that’s when our internal world shifts back to regularity and homeostasis.

That’s why every human being on the earth was born to rule their life and when we take ownership over every result, it will grow at the highest level. And whatever area we ignore, that area will deteriorate quickly without our help. 

When you finally take ownership over everything in your business you’ve been given to steward by God, you’ll see massive shifts take place because you won’t blame your lack of resources for stunted growth, but your lack of resourcefulness.

You’ll assume the identity of the person who already has permission by God to have massive success in your business while impacting others in the process and you can’t help but be different.

Why? Because permission makes your next level possible, while ownership makes your next level real. 

Key Verses: Genesis 1:28-29 – God created human beings to have dominion over the earth – He made them to rule their world and not allow anything to rule them

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